The OFFICIAL programming thread
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Buy a film camera.
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Sweden
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I know from years of learning other shit that the SmallTalk language has been hugely influential in programming but I’ve never used it or seen it used in the wild and I was curious about it. Turns out there is a modern variant called Pharo that is under active development so I downloaded it and started playing with it last night.
SmallTalk is kind of weird and is giving me strong Common Lisp vibes: Stupidly simple syntax and programming in a running state machine (image) where you develop by changing the program while it’s running.
Below is what is claimed to be the full syntax of the language:
I just love how all this shit exists and is free for anyone to use or play with.
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If you can put aside maybe some unfamiliarity with his core argument, the below was a really interesting talk on computer history going back to the 50’s and how we got to where we are with OOP programming as it is mostly practiced today:
Trigger warning: he comes out swinging against C++ pretty early so if you like C++ it might piss you off but the core of his argument is really against what calls something like compile time domain modelling of hierarchies - basically deep class hierarchies that model how we think of the world (Vehicle -> Car -> Sports Car). I don’t think the latter is really very controversial anymore since I’ve been hearing “favor composition over inheritance” as being the prevailing wisdom for maybe a decade or longer.
Edit: Gemini tells me the “favor composition” advice was in Design Patterns so that goes way back.
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2½ hour video? Maybe a DL on WiFi in town, sometime.
Cliff notes, anyone?
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@Hog said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:
If you can put aside maybe some unfamiliarity with his core argument, the below was a really interesting talk on computer history going back to the 50’s and how we got to where we are with OOP programming as it is mostly practiced today:
Trigger warning: he comes out swinging against C++ pretty early so if you like C++ it might piss you off but the core of his argument is really against what calls something like compile time domain modelling of hierarchies - basically deep class hierarchies that model how we think of the world (Vehicle -> Car -> Sports Car). I don’t think the latter is really very controversial anymore since I’ve been hearing “favor composition over inheritance” as being the prevailing wisdom for maybe a decade or longer.
Edit: Gemini tells me the “favor composition” advice was in Design Patterns so that goes way back.
Reminds me of the logic behind zero trust- define your security structure and methods/efforts geared towards actual need, not lazy ass assumptions about what box gets whose access.
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I guess Amazon will have to hire back those 30K people now…
Vibe Coding, Six Months Later: The Honeymoon’s Over
Six months after the hype began, is vibe coding sustainable? We look at the pros and cons, and why blending vibes with structure is key.
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Vibe coding’s strength lies in helping you find direction quickly, but vibe engineering simply isn’t there yet.
“Vibe engineering” being a contradiction in terms might shed some light there.
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@Hog said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:
Vibe coding’s strength lies in helping you find direction quickly, but vibe engineering simply isn’t there yet.
“Vibe engineering” being a contradiction in terms might shed some light there.
Stop trying to harsh our vibe dude
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@Blanks said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:
@Hog said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:
Vibe coding’s strength lies in helping you find direction quickly, but vibe engineering simply isn’t there yet.
“Vibe engineering” being a contradiction in terms might shed some light there.
Stop trying to harsh our vibe dude
Another gaddam user.
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I’m learning the Odin programming language. By default, when you save your source code the LSP reformats your code to the Odin recommended style. OK. I don’t love it when languages come with highly opinionated programming styles but I can learn to swallow my bile when it does things like replace my spaces with tabs. But then it goes and does this:
What kind of un-gohly fucking terrorist aligns the case conditions with the switch?
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Isn’t Odin Finnish? You have your answer
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@Hog said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:
OK. I don’t love it when languages come with highly opinionated programming styles
That’s exactly why I try to stay far away from python.
EDIT
That indentation style is unacceptable to my OCB.
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Weenies.
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@Kilemall said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:
Weenies.
Eighty columns ought to be enough for everybody?
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@rote7 said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:
@Kilemall said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:
Weenies.
Eighty columns ought to be enough for everybody?
Damn straight.
Plus computer don’t care about neat placement. Syntax is another matter, that’s the madness of language/OS designers.
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Computers should be shot!
"Let's give it a week! Still a disaster? Let's give it another week…" -Tazz
Casey Muratori – The Big OOPs: Anatomy of a Thirty-five-year Mistake – BSC 2025
Odin Programming Language
