The OFFICIAL programming thread

[Kilemall]

@Slpr said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Hog said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Hog said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

Best way is to just get in and try it / start using Linux but I don’t know enough about your scenario to make an intelligent contribution.

Making this a separate reply because an edit might be missed:

Best way to --> get familiar with and learn Linux <-- is to get in and try it / start using it. Not sure it’s a great idea to learn with something that is critical or that could have financial and legal implications because you are contractually responsible for supporting it.

Let me ask you this, you’re old enough, have you ever even build your own kernel?


So long Slpr

I never went down that path but a friend compiled his kernel the first month dual core support came out.

[Gustaf]

@Hog said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Gustaf said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

This is the most interesting thread ever!*

I’m curious. How would you know what an interesting thread looks like?

All the threads you don’t post in!

[Gators1]

@Gustaf said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Hog said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Gustaf said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

This is the most interesting thread ever!*

I’m curious. How would you know what an interesting thread looks like?

All the threads you don’t post in!

Hog is the bestest poster here. My favorite Hog post was “If Gustaf doesn’t STFU, I am adding his ass to my pile of skulls!”

[Gustaf]

@Gators1 said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Gustaf said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Hog said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Gustaf said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

This is the most interesting thread ever!*

I’m curious. How would you know what an interesting thread looks like?

All the threads you don’t post in!

Hog is the bestest poster here. My favorite Hog post was “If Gustaf doesn’t STFU, I am adding his ass to my pile of skulls!”

You’re totally taking that line out of context! It was actually a compliment of my amazing features!

[Gators1]

@Gustaf said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Gators1 said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Gustaf said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Hog said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Gustaf said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

This is the most interesting thread ever!*

I’m curious. How would you know what an interesting thread looks like?

All the threads you don’t post in!

Hog is the bestest poster here. My favorite Hog post was “If Gustaf doesn’t STFU, I am adding his ass to my pile of skulls!”

You’re totally taking that line out of context! It was actually a compliment of my amazing features!

He was confused between your ass and face.

[Gustaf]

Zachary Disease

[Kilemall]

@Gustaf said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

This is the most interesting thread ever!*

You remind me of the kid in this ad-

Pay with PayPal

[Gustaf]

I’m not a ginger!!!

[Gators1]

Was playing with vibe coding to get some ideas for a map plotting app I have been working on. App is pretty simple but not used to the library. I pretty much just let the AI do it’s thing and it got worse and worse over time. It keeps dropping md files with summaries of changes it makes instead of updating the task file and went from a working app to completely fucked up over a request for a color change. Here’s the current structure and the main.py is over 500 lines just to load a parquet file and plot the data with some user parameter widgets on a webpage. Sadly I think Skynet is many years away.

[Lithu]

@Gators1 said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

Was playing with vibe coding to get some ideas for a map plotting app I have been working on. App is pretty simple but not used to the library. I pretty much just let the AI do it’s thing and it got worse and worse over time. It keeps dropping md files with summaries of changes it makes instead of updating the task file and went from a working app to completely fucked up over a request for a color change. Here’s the current structure and the main.py is over 500 lines just to load a parquet file and plot the data with some user parameter widgets on a webpage. Sadly I think Skynet is many years away.

That’s called… User Error.

[Gators1]

Where is LOT 4.0?

[Lithu]

@Gators1 said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

Where is LOT 4.0?

[Hog]

@Gators1 said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

Was playing with vibe coding to get some ideas for a map plotting app I have been working on. App is pretty simple but not used to the library. I pretty much just let the AI do it’s thing and it got worse and worse over time. It keeps dropping md files with summaries of changes it makes instead of updating the task file and went from a working app to completely fucked up over a request for a color change. Here’s the current structure and the main.py is over 500 lines just to load a parquet file and plot the data with some user parameter widgets on a webpage. Sadly I think Skynet is many years away.

I recently started following this stuff on Reddit and it’s interesting to hear what people say you have to do to overcome all these issues. It’s a lot of work and, unless you are unfamiliar with the target language, it’s probably bordering on being easier to code it yourself. Every now and then you’ll get a “I’m rage-quitting ai-coding” post that says all the mitigations are bullshit and you still end up with a unmaintainable mess.

Dunno, I’m still of the opinion that it’s slightly more value than it is a hassle but I do surgical changes one at a time and never big bang a bunch of changes. Even with the way I use it, making sure the AI isn’t fucking up your app is still tiring and stressful though.

[Gators1]

@Hog said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Gators1 said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

Was playing with vibe coding to get some ideas for a map plotting app I have been working on. App is pretty simple but not used to the library. I pretty much just let the AI do it’s thing and it got worse and worse over time. It keeps dropping md files with summaries of changes it makes instead of updating the task file and went from a working app to completely fucked up over a request for a color change. Here’s the current structure and the main.py is over 500 lines just to load a parquet file and plot the data with some user parameter widgets on a webpage. Sadly I think Skynet is many years away.

I recently started following this stuff on Reddit and it’s interesting to hear what people say you have to do to overcome all these issues. It’s a lot of work and, unless you are unfamiliar with the target language, it’s probably bordering on being easier to code it yourself. Every now and then you’ll get a “I’m rage-quitting ai-coding” post that says all the mitigations are bullshit and you still end up with a unmaintainable mess.

Dunno, I’m still of the opinion that it’s slightly more value than it is a hassle but I do surgical changes one at a time and never big bang a bunch of changes. Even with the way I use it, making sure the AI isn’t fucking up your app is still tiring and stressful though.

Yeah, targeted changes aren’t bad. You can easily see what happens in the diff. It’s more like when you request a significant change and it comes back with 300 lines of changes across 10 files. It got wierd though with some error fixes where it was writing entirely new files to test things and the md files describing the changes it made that it already also described in the chat window. Have not seen that before.

[tigger]

@Slpr said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Hog said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Slpr said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Hog said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Slpr said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Hog said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Hog said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

Best way is to just get in and try it / start using Linux but I don’t know enough about your scenario to make an intelligent contribution.

Making this a separate reply because an edit might be missed:

Best way to --> get familiar with and learn Linux <-- is to get in and try it / start using it. Not sure it’s a great idea to learn with something that is critical or that could have financial and legal implications because you are contractually responsible for supporting it.

Let me ask you this, you’re old enough, have you ever even build your own kernel?


So long Slpr

Nah, the biggest thing like that that I ever attempted was writing my own language, parser and compiler in Rust. Didn’t finish it (I mean, it worked but was missing half the features I wanted) but I learned a lot doing it.

No no, you misconstrued, I did not mean to write your own kernel, I meant compile one or a couple thereof to your needs (from scratch at best).


So long Slpr

Ah okay. No, not yet. I keep meaning to work through Linux From Scratch one day but haven’t got there yet.

No worries, but it is gratifying booting your own kernel for the first time, not that I went that far building a whole business backbone out of a self compiling distribution like @rote7 did when he worked for a local cable company.


So long Slpr

This is pretty strange to me tbh. Back in the day nothing would work without patches and hacks, no? Did I just live on particularly unusual hardware? Generally ethernet would not work, sound cards would not work, later in the early 2000s the WiFi cards we stuck into our laptops wouldn’t be working without rewriting the drivers here and there…
I rather remember the first time I was running a stock kernel and everything was fine.

Maybe that’s when I learned to hate computers?

[oyaji]

@Slpr said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

booting your own kernel

Now that got my attention.

Is that the sort of thing that is required to defeat surveillance and hacking? I mean, like for a limited feature Android phone and/or Linux laptop? I’ve been wanting that sort of thing since teh 9ty-'leventy.

You know, to be able to go back to the kind of Internet that Al Gore invented, and the kind of phone service that was available back then.

[Hog]

I just put up with broken hardware for the most part although I vaguely recall buying more compatible gear once or twice. I think I was always able to eventually find a WiFi or ethernet driver that worked but I do remember having one or two machines without working sound.

Like you said, most of that stuff just works now but I think it’s another argument for microkernels. I’m guessing you could virtualize window drivers where a Linux driver didn’t exist. Would have been too slow maybe a decade ago but probably not now.

Edit: Gemini and Claude say no.

[Slpr]

@oyaji said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Slpr said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

booting your own kernel

Now that got my attention.

Is that the sort of thing that is required to defeat surveillance and hacking? I mean, like for a limited feature Android phone and/or Linux laptop? I’ve been wanting that sort of thing since teh 9ty-'leventy.

You know, to be able to go back to the kind of Internet that Al Gore invented, and the kind of phone service that was available back then.

Well that was in the early days of linux, at times you had to compile your own kernel, set variables differently and/or aplly fixes to get other processses working properly. But also to prevent hacking, yes. But even today I believe having a stripped down to the essentials/minimal kernel is the way to go.


So long Slpr

[oyaji]

@Slpr said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@oyaji said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Slpr said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

booting your own kernel

Now that got my attention.

Is that the sort of thing that is required to defeat surveillance and hacking? I mean, like for a limited feature Android phone and/or Linux laptop? I’ve been wanting that sort of thing since teh 9ty-'leventy.

You know, to be able to go back to the kind of Internet that Al Gore invented, and the kind of phone service that was available back then.

Well that was in the early days of linux, at times you had to compile your own kernel, set variables differently and/or aplly fixes to get other processses working properly. But also to prevent hacking, yes. But even today I believe having a stripped down to the essentials/minimal kernel is the way to go.


So long Slpr

So how can I get a stripped down system on my phone? And laptop? Getting stuck with all that bloatware on Windows was why I wanted Linux in the first place, back around Y2K.

[Slpr]

@oyaji said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Slpr said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@oyaji said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

@Slpr said in The OFFICIAL programming thread:

booting your own kernel

Now that got my attention.

Is that the sort of thing that is required to defeat surveillance and hacking? I mean, like for a limited feature Android phone and/or Linux laptop? I’ve been wanting that sort of thing since teh 9ty-'leventy.

You know, to be able to go back to the kind of Internet that Al Gore invented, and the kind of phone service that was available back then.

Well that was in the early days of linux, at times you had to compile your own kernel, set variables differently and/or aplly fixes to get other processses working properly. But also to prevent hacking, yes. But even today I believe having a stripped down to the essentials/minimal kernel is the way to go.


So long Slpr

So how can I get a stripped down system on my phone? And laptop? Getting stuck with all that bloatware on Windows was why I wanted Linux in the first place, back around Y2K.

Have not done Android myself yet, but it is possible. HowTo For your laptop it depends on your distribution, there are several great websites for that. For example kernelnewbies or archlinux.


So long Slpr